From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

After updating Veeam Agent for Windows, my daily backup is no longer
being executed. The cause seems to be related to the "Modern Standby
power model".

https://i.imgur.com/anaEhTW.png

I am still running Windows 11 23H2 for compatibility reasons with some
of my printers.

I have disabled every form of power saving. The computer is always on,
never goes into standby, the disks are always active, the network
adapter is always active, and everything is configured for maximum performance. The only exception is that the monitor turns off after 20 minutes.

Despite this, for about a month I have been experiencing this problem.
It only happens on my computer, and I cannot figure out why.

Various AI assistants have suggested solutions that I had already
tried.

I upgraded Veeam Agent to the latest version, 13.1.1.700, from
13.1.0.544, but nothing changed.

I have not yet tried completely uninstalling and reinstalling Veeam
Agent.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?
--
/-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ T /-\
-=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- - -=-
-.-. .... . ... .. ...- .. -. -.-. .- --- -.-. .... . ... .. .--. . .-.
-.. .-
..-. --- .-. --.. .- - --- .-. --- . .--- ..- ...- . -- . .-. -.. .-
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ammammata <ammammata@tiscali.it> wrote:

After updating Veeam Agent for Windows, my daily backup is no longer
being executed. The cause seems to be related to the "Modern Standby
power model".

https://i.imgur.com/anaEhTW.png

I am still running Windows 11 23H2 for compatibility reasons with some
of my printers.

I have disabled every form of power saving. The computer is always on,
never goes into standby, the disks are always active, the network
adapter is always active, and everything is configured for maximum performance. The only exception is that the monitor turns off after 20 minutes.

Despite this, for about a month I have been experiencing this problem.
It only happens on my computer, and I cannot figure out why.

Various AI assistants have suggested solutions that I had already
tried.

I upgraded Veeam Agent to the latest version, 13.1.1.700, from
13.1.0.544, but nothing changed.

I have not yet tried completely uninstalling and reinstalling Veeam
Agent.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?

I don't use Veeam. The following is what I found in web research.

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/design/device-experiences/modern-standby

Doesn't say how to disable this power scheme. It does mention:

Modern Standby consists of multiple hardware and software power modes,
all of which occur with the screen turned off.

So, maybe try to configure the screen to NOT power off in your current
power scheme, and test if Veeam then works.

Did Veeam get recently updated? If so, maybe they have a bug. You
mentioned updating, but maybe the bug showed up in an earlier version.

"Nowadays, many laptops can't even enter S3 anymore - it's either Modern Standby or fully on." (https://forums.veeam.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=90224&start=0)

According to that poster, he used Windows' own Task Scheduler instead of relying on Veeam's background scheduler process. However, he mentions
enabling wake timers to let Veeam do its job. Well, many scheduled
tasks need to use wake timers to run. Did you check your power scheme
to check if wake timers was enabled?
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Wed, 9/2/2026 4:51 AM, Ammammata wrote:

After updating Veeam Agent for Windows, my daily backup is no longer being executed. The cause seems to be related to the "Modern Standby power model".

https://i.imgur.com/anaEhTW.png

I am still running Windows 11 23H2 for compatibility reasons with some of my printers.

I have disabled every form of power saving. The computer is always on, never goes into standby, the disks are always active, the network adapter is always active, and everything is configured for maximum performance. The only exception is that the monitor turns off after 20 minutes.

Despite this, for about a month I have been experiencing this problem. It only happens on my computer, and I cannot figure out why.

Various AI assistants have suggested solutions that I had already tried.

I upgraded Veeam Agent to the latest version, 13.1.1.700, from 13.1.0.544, but nothing changed.

I have not yet tried completely uninstalling and reinstalling Veeam Agent.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?

First of all, VeeAM should fix this to their own satisfaction.

Putting up dialogs like that, that's amateur hour.
As one IT guy put it, "why not ask Microsoft how to write this code?".
It's not up to end-users to re-engineer a failed software project.

This is the model - diagram near bottom of page:

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/design/device-experiences/prepare-software-for-modern-standby

On Macrium Reflect, these are their services

ReflectMonitor.exe
ReflectUI.exe
MacriumService.exe session0 <=== I suspect this is the one that runs under threat of being throttled.
It's actual runtime duration would be strictly limited (blip mode).
It has to be able to raise an Event, to the rest of the backup system.
"Session-0 services are throttled by the DAM to
no more than one second of activity every 30 seconds."

Using Scheduled Tasks, play a movie starting just before 22:00 time.
Movie players assert a bit which keeps the screen alive while
a movie plays. I just started playing a 3 hour movie under VLC, before doing the following.

Now, while that movie plays, do

Powercfg.exe /requests # administrator window

DISPLAY:
[PROCESS] \Device\HarddiskVolume3\Program Files\WSL\msrdc.exe
RAIL Power Request
[PROCESS] \Device\HarddiskVolume3\Program Files\VideoLAN\VLC\vlc.exe <=== this helps prevent power-saving

SYSTEM:
[DRIVER] Realtek High Definition Audio (HDAUDIO\FUNC_01&VEN_10EC&DEV_0892&SUBSYS_1462...)
An audio stream is currently in use.
[PROCESS] \Device\HarddiskVolume3\Program Files\WSL\msrdc.exe
RAIL Power Request
[PROCESS] \Device\HarddiskVolume3\Program Files\VideoLAN\VLC\vlc.exe

AWAYMODE:
None.

EXECUTION:
None.

PERFBOOST:
None.

ACTIVELOCKSCREEN:
None.

Now, the VeeAM private scheduler should be able to run and start the backup.

If the VeeAM has a "post-cleanup script" capability, you would put a "Kill" command in, to kill the VLC movie playback once the backup is finished. That way,
the computer can drop to the resiliency power level.

For the VLC movie, you can replace the sound track with a "quiet" sound track. This keeps the request to the audio channel, but there is no sound to keep
you awake.

*******

This is what one customer proposes.

Microsoft Task Scheduler --> Kick VeeAM scheduler (EndPoint Manager) --> <run the backup>
(XML file tweaked for Maintenance Window
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
execution when "sleeping")

which effectively defeats the whole purpose of the VeeAM software.

https://forums.veeam.com/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=90224&start=0

"I manually exported, edited and re-imported the scheduled task XML file to
add the relevant configuration for an automatic maintenance task"

...
<Exec>
<Command>"C:\Program Files\Veeam\Endpoint Backup\Veeam.EndPoint.Manager.exe"</Command>
<Arguments>backup 54216ddc-6733-4ef5-9e31-275ca4f7fc70</Arguments>
</Exec>

[Which is a command from here]

https://helpcenter.veeam.com/docs/agentforwindows/userguide/backup_cmd.html?ver=13

But generally speaking, the Google results are rife, with knowledgeable people explaining to VeeAM Tech Support what to do. Notice that this isn't helping. Either the devs are incompetent, or they are tone-deaf. As one IT person put it...

"Why don't you ask Microsoft how to fit a backup service into Modern Standby environment"

as that is pretty sage advice for the devs. Whether Microsoft charges for these incidents,
I don't know. But as a dev, that would be the only thing to stop me, is getting approval from
management to do that.

*******

Normally, the LLM-AI run in "quick query mode", using a minimal amount of tokens.
They have the ability to reach way into the noise, and find signal. If a solution
was really available, and a lot of users had used it, a high quality answer would
come back.

If you suspect it is not doing a good job, you can try using "High Reasoning", not to actually "think up an answer", but in that mode, the LLM-Ai can conclude it is actually guessing. It never bluntly says "I don't know", but it can be convinced to admit it is guessing.

If the "High Reasoning" setting at the bottom of the screen is not available, add this to the question.
The Strategy Planner knows that some questions will need High Reasoning mode, but you
don't just come out and say that to the machine :-) You have to tease them like this.
If you were paying for tokens, in the worst case this might take 10x tokens. Some
non-convergent runs, it can tell there is a problem after only a few runs of the
question, so it truncates the sequence quickly and gives the "guessing" indication.

"Work slowly and carefully, giving a precise answer" <=== this indicates you want "High Reasoning".
repeated question runs, with terse summaries,
until convergence is detected (or not).

I ran that on my computer across the way, a High Reasoning run, and
the machine babbled to itself for 8 minutes, then it took 42 minutes
to print out the answer. That is just to give some idea of the relative
time scales for this sort of thing, on grossly inadequate hardware. If you
run in quick query mode, thinking takes 2 seconds, token output takes 4 minutes.
Notice the entirely different ratio, between thinking and outputting. You should
not conclude too much from these numbers, except that High Reasoning costs
more tokens. Which is fine, if the tokens are free. Until you've used up
your daily allotment.

Paul


--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ammammata used his keyboard to write :

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?

i received this tip:

https://www.isunshare.com/windows-10/tutorial-how-to-disable-modern-standby-in-windows-10-and-11.html

tomorrow I'll if it's good or it's another nice trick that doesn't work
:-)

I'm quite confident because changing a parameter in the backup
configuration I didn't get the warning any more
--
/-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ T /-\
-=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- - -=-
-.-. .... . ... .. ...- .. -. -.-. .- --- -.-. .... . ... .. .--. . .-.
-.. .-
..-. --- .-. --.. .- - --- .-. --- . .--- ..- ...- . -- . .-. -.. .-
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11



See if this image helps:

<https://mega.nz/file/Xth2xYAR#HW4IhDCZMcDSkvVUZxx54_aEgMaQLMb8lDk3UDnmEvA>

I took this image in 23H2 like yours. This works for me.



On 02/09/2026 09:51, Ammammata wrote:

After updating Veeam Agent for Windows, my daily backup is no longer
being executed. The cause seems to be related to the "Modern Standby
power model".

https://i.imgur.com/anaEhTW.png

I am still running Windows 11 23H2 for compatibility reasons with some
of my printers.

I have disabled every form of power saving. The computer is always on,
never goes into standby, the disks are always active, the network
adapter is always active, and everything is configured for maximum performance. The only exception is that the monitor turns off after 20 minutes.

Despite this, for about a month I have been experiencing this problem.
It only happens on my computer, and I cannot figure out why.

Various AI assistants have suggested solutions that I had already tried.

I upgraded Veeam Agent to the latest version, 13.1.1.700, from
13.1.0.544, but nothing changed.

I have not yet tried completely uninstalling and reinstalling Veeam Agent.

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ammammata <ammammata@tiscali.it> wrote:

i received this tip:

https://www.isunshare.com/windows-10/tutorial-how-to-disable-modern-standby-in-windows-10-and-11.html

tomorrow I'll if it's good or it's another nice trick that doesn't work
:-)

I'm quite confident because changing a parameter in the backup
configuration I didn't get the warning any more

Modern Standby seems to be a Windows thing only on laptops. You didn't
mention your platform, but what I found about that power scheme was
about laptops. Also, the forum article I cited is 3 years old, so Veeam
not waking up its own scheduler process, not as a Task Scheduler event,
is an old problem with Veeam.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ammammata wrote:

tomorrow I'll if it's good or it's another nice trick that doesn't work :-)

ok, it worked :)
--
/-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ T /-\
-=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- - -=-
-.-. .... . ... .. ...- .. -. -.-. .- --- -.-. .... . ... .. .--. . .-.
-.. .-
..-. --- .-. --.. .- - --- .-. --- . .--- ..- ...- . -- . .-. -.. .-
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

VanguardLH wrote on 03/09/2026 :

You didn't
mention your platform

Lenovo ThinkCentre model 11U50006MZ
--
/-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ /\/\ /\/\ /-\ T /-\
-=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- -=- - -=-
-.-. .... . ... .. ...- .. -. -.-. .- --- -.-. .... . ... .. .--. . .-.
-.. .-
..-. --- .-. --.. .- - --- .-. --- . .--- ..- ...- . -- . .-. -.. .-
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

VanguardLH wrote:

Ammammata <ammammata@tiscali.it> wrote:

i received this tip:

https://www.isunshare.com/windows-10/tutorial-how-to-disable-modern-standby-in-windows-10-and-11.html

tomorrow I'll if it's good or it's another nice trick that doesn't work
:-)

I'm quite confident because changing a parameter in the backup
configuration I didn't get the warning any more

Modern Standby seems to be a Windows thing only on laptops. You didn't mention your platform, but what I found about that power scheme was
about laptops. Also, the forum article I cited is 3 years old, so Veeam
not waking up its own scheduler process, not as a Task Scheduler event,
is an old problem with Veeam.

run "powercfg /a" is a cmd window

if you want Modern standby disabled, you do *NOT* want to see
"Standby (S0 Low Power Idle) Network Connected"

any S3 Sleep setting you can enable in BIOS/UEFI ?

add or edit

HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Power
[DWORD]PlatformAoAcOverride=0


--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Ammammata <ammammata@tiscali.it> wrote:

i received this tip:

https://www.isunshare.com/windows-10/tutorial-how-to-disable-modern-standby-in-windows-10-and-11.html

tomorrow I'll if it's good or it's another nice trick that doesn't work
:-)

I'm quite confident because changing a parameter in the backup
configuration I didn't get the warning any more

Modern Standby seems to be a Windows thing only on laptops. You didn't
mention your platform, but what I found about that power scheme was
about laptops. Also, the forum article I cited is 3 years old, so Veeam
not waking up its own scheduler process, not as a Task Scheduler event,
is an old problem with Veeam.

run "powercfg /a" is a cmd window

if you want Modern standby disabled, you do *NOT* want to see
"Standby (S0 Low Power Idle) Network Connected"

On my desktop PC, that reports:

Standby (S0 Low Power Idle)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

It also says my desktop (firmware) does not support that power mode, so,
again, looks like a laptop-only thing, and perhaps only for later
laptops with the requisite hardware or BIOS code. Apparently the OP's
laptop does support that power mode, but that Veeam's scheduler program
can't run when it is enabled is, as Paul said, a defect with Veeam. The
forum article I found was 3 year old. Could be older since I didn't
research any and all articles trying to circumvent the problem. I did
find older articles for the OP's laptop discussing problems with Modern
Standby power mode, and also on laptops.

Modern Standby power mode dates back to 2020, maybe earlier. Showed up
in Windows 8.0 (*). Modern Standby, originally called Connected is a
kind of sleep state where the system operates at nearly power down
levels but is still in a S0 operating mode. Modern Standby has 2
states: Connected (MSC), and Disconnected (MSD). In MSC mode, the system
wakes up at regular intervals. This also means your system connects to
the Internet, so it could retrieve updates. Support came with Modern
apps (UWP apps: Universal Windows Apps); e.g., Mail, Calendar. (https://developers.hp.com/hp-client-management/blog/optimize-windows-power-profiles-with-hp-system-default-settings)

(*) Windows 8.0 was released back in 2012, so Connected Mode, later
renamed to Modern Standby, has been around a long time -- on laptops.
So, Veeam has been ignorant of this power mode for way over a decade,
and never fixed their scheduler program nor to scrapped it for Task
Scheduler which doesn't have the problem (unless you configure a task to
*not* allow wakeup timers).

HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Power
[DWORD]PlatformAoAcOverride=0

I checked, but that is not defined, so my Windows is not explicitly
configured to disable that power mode. Doesn't need a disable, anyway,
since my desktop's hardware/BIOS doesn't support it.

The fault cause is with Veeam.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Thu, 9/3/2026 2:03 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

Modern Standby power mode dates back to 2020, maybe earlier.

Originally, for the first generation, Modern Standby was
only shipping on Surface products. Companies like HP/Dell
were worried it wasn't ripe yet. Microsoft did the field
test, using their Surface customers.

It's not clear, how many years passed before it became
common on other OEM laptops.

And was that added to the five hundred page ACPI spec ?
As it existed as a custom variant. It's not like S3 is
"deprecated", all the desktops in the room are not
Modern Standby and it is not a setting in a BIOS.
Presumably this is a battery life play, rather than
essential to a desktop "ECO" setting. (ECO is where
a two die CPU, you can turn off one of the dies to
cut power consumption, which is effectively
throwing away $300 worth of silicon.)

Paul


--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 9/3/2026 5:09 PM, Paul wrote:

On Thu, 9/3/2026 2:03 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

Modern Standby power mode dates back to 2020, maybe earlier.

Originally, for the first generation, Modern Standby was
only shipping on Surface products. Companies like HP/Dell
were worried it wasn't ripe yet. Microsoft did the field
test, using their Surface customers.

It's not clear, how many years passed before it became
common on other OEM laptops.

And was that added to the five hundred page ACPI spec ?
As it existed as a custom variant. It's not like S3 is
"deprecated", all the desktops in the room are not
Modern Standby and it is not a setting in a BIOS.
Presumably this is a battery life play, rather than
essential to a desktop "ECO" setting. (ECO is where
a two die CPU, you can turn off one of the dies to
cut power consumption, which is effectively
throwing away $300 worth of silicon.)

Another disturbing ECO thing I found and dislike is how it controls the cooling. If it doesn't notice activity for some period of time, not
sure what the limit is exactly, it takes control of the fan and idles
them down which raises the heat of everything just to save a couple of fractions of a cent on energy usage. I ended up having to use a mouse
jiggler set for under a minute to fool the system into thinking I was
there just to keep the control in my hands.
--
Science Doesn’t Support Darwin. Scientists Do

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

On 9/3/2026 5:09 PM, Paul wrote:

On Thu, 9/3/2026 2:03 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

Modern Standby power mode dates back to 2020, maybe earlier.

Originally, for the first generation, Modern Standby was
only shipping on Surface products. Companies like HP/Dell
were worried it wasn't ripe yet. Microsoft did the field
test, using their Surface customers.

It's not clear, how many years passed before it became
common on other OEM laptops.

And was that added to the five hundred page ACPI spec ?
As it existed as a custom variant. It's not like S3 is
"deprecated", all the desktops in the room are not
Modern Standby and it is not a setting in a BIOS.
Presumably this is a battery life play, rather than
essential to a desktop "ECO" setting. (ECO is where
a two die CPU, you can turn off one of the dies to
cut power consumption, which is effectively
throwing away $300 worth of silicon.)

Another disturbing ECO thing I found and dislike is how it controls the cooling. If it doesn't notice activity for some period of time, not
sure what the limit is exactly, it takes control of the fan and idles
them down which raises the heat of everything just to save a couple of fractions of a cent on energy usage. I ended up having to use a mouse jiggler set for under a minute to fool the system into thinking I was
there just to keep the control in my hands.

For my desktop PC, I use the high power scheme. I want my PC available
the instant I return to it whether that be later in the day, or when I
wake up (which is 2 to 3 times per night). I don't need to save power
on my desktop PC to save on electrical bills which would have little
difference of more than a few cents. Even if it were $5 USD, I still
wouldn't care, because the convenience of immediate access is worth the
cost. I *always* have instant on with my desktop, because it never
sleeps, hibernates, or powers down. However, for laptops that are
actually mobile (not the ones that are stationary acting as desktops in
one location all the time), I can see trying to save on battery power.
Yet I don't see the need for instant on with Modern Standby. A second,
or two, to come out of S3 is fine with me. I don't need instant on to
point a laptop's camera at some crime scene the instant it happens.
That's why folks have cameras in mobile phones.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 9/3/2026 6:53 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

On 9/3/2026 5:09 PM, Paul wrote:

On Thu, 9/3/2026 2:03 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

Modern Standby power mode dates back to 2020, maybe earlier.

Originally, for the first generation, Modern Standby was
only shipping on Surface products. Companies like HP/Dell
were worried it wasn't ripe yet. Microsoft did the field
test, using their Surface customers.

It's not clear, how many years passed before it became
common on other OEM laptops.

And was that added to the five hundred page ACPI spec ?
As it existed as a custom variant. It's not like S3 is
"deprecated", all the desktops in the room are not
Modern Standby and it is not a setting in a BIOS.
Presumably this is a battery life play, rather than
essential to a desktop "ECO" setting. (ECO is where
a two die CPU, you can turn off one of the dies to
cut power consumption, which is effectively
throwing away $300 worth of silicon.)

Another disturbing ECO thing I found and dislike is how it controls the
cooling. If it doesn't notice activity for some period of time, not
sure what the limit is exactly, it takes control of the fan and idles
them down which raises the heat of everything just to save a couple of
fractions of a cent on energy usage. I ended up having to use a mouse
jiggler set for under a minute to fool the system into thinking I was
there just to keep the control in my hands.

For my desktop PC, I use the high power scheme. I want my PC available
the instant I return to it whether that be later in the day, or when I
wake up (which is 2 to 3 times per night). I don't need to save power
on my desktop PC to save on electrical bills which would have little difference of more than a few cents. Even if it were $5 USD, I still wouldn't care, because the convenience of immediate access is worth the
cost. I *always* have instant on with my desktop, because it never
sleeps, hibernates, or powers down. However, for laptops that are
actually mobile (not the ones that are stationary acting as desktops in
one location all the time), I can see trying to save on battery power.
Yet I don't see the need for instant on with Modern Standby. A second,
or two, to come out of S3 is fine with me. I don't need instant on to
point a laptop's camera at some crime scene the instant it happens.
That's why folks have cameras in mobile phones.

I failed to mention that I am also talking about a desktop. The thread
on the fan upgrade can be seen in alt.comp.hardware explaining all the difficulties. The main problem was this HP lives in the garage without
AC and I like to keep it running for various reasons. It gets hot so I
added a extra case fan, but no matter what settings I adjusted, I would
go out and it would be 30F warmer because of the system idling down the
fans.

It also ties into this thread because one of the other things I had to
do was quit simply putting it to sleep at night. I would come out and
find it sitting there waiting for me to input my passwords without the
proper fans running as needed when it gets hot. I also installed and
use FanControl to keep it cool. Being a relatively new system, it does
fire up very quickly, so shutting it off does end the worry about it overheating during the night because it started up for an unknown
reason. I intended to check into and figure out what causes this, but
have just decided I'll shut if down at night and be done with the worry.
--
Science Doesn’t Support Darwin. Scientists Do

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

On 9/3/2026 6:53 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

On 9/3/2026 5:09 PM, Paul wrote:

On Thu, 9/3/2026 2:03 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

Modern Standby power mode dates back to 2020, maybe earlier.

Originally, for the first generation, Modern Standby was
only shipping on Surface products. Companies like HP/Dell
were worried it wasn't ripe yet. Microsoft did the field
test, using their Surface customers.

It's not clear, how many years passed before it became
common on other OEM laptops.

And was that added to the five hundred page ACPI spec ?
As it existed as a custom variant. It's not like S3 is
"deprecated", all the desktops in the room are not
Modern Standby and it is not a setting in a BIOS.
Presumably this is a battery life play, rather than
essential to a desktop "ECO" setting. (ECO is where
a two die CPU, you can turn off one of the dies to
cut power consumption, which is effectively
throwing away $300 worth of silicon.)

Another disturbing ECO thing I found and dislike is how it controls the
cooling. If it doesn't notice activity for some period of time, not
sure what the limit is exactly, it takes control of the fan and idles
them down which raises the heat of everything just to save a couple of
fractions of a cent on energy usage. I ended up having to use a mouse
jiggler set for under a minute to fool the system into thinking I was
there just to keep the control in my hands.

For my desktop PC, I use the high power scheme. I want my PC available
the instant I return to it whether that be later in the day, or when I
wake up (which is 2 to 3 times per night). I don't need to save power
on my desktop PC to save on electrical bills which would have little
difference of more than a few cents. Even if it were $5 USD, I still
wouldn't care, because the convenience of immediate access is worth the
cost. I *always* have instant on with my desktop, because it never
sleeps, hibernates, or powers down. However, for laptops that are
actually mobile (not the ones that are stationary acting as desktops in
one location all the time), I can see trying to save on battery power.
Yet I don't see the need for instant on with Modern Standby. A second,
or two, to come out of S3 is fine with me. I don't need instant on to
point a laptop's camera at some crime scene the instant it happens.
That's why folks have cameras in mobile phones.

I failed to mention that I am also talking about a desktop. The thread
on the fan upgrade can be seen in alt.comp.hardware explaining all the difficulties. The main problem was this HP lives in the garage without
AC and I like to keep it running for various reasons. It gets hot so I added a extra case fan, but no matter what settings I adjusted, I would
go out and it would be 30F warmer because of the system idling down the fans.

There aren't header pins on the mobo for non-monitored and uncontrolled
fans that would run all the time at full speed? If no constant power
fan headers on the mobo, perhaps a BIOS setting would force always-on at always-high speed. If not, use a 2-pin fan onto a 3-pin fan header.
You could use a Molex Y-adapter the supply power to whatever is at the
other end, plus supply constant (unregulated power, and non-pulsed)
power to a case fan. Or, remove the side panel from the case, and point
a table fan into the case.

If the BIOS doesn't let you control fan speed how you want, maybe
Speedfan can be configured to always run a fan at full speed. While its
intent is to control fan speed according to temperatures, I recall you
could have it run a fan at full speed regardless of temperature. But
you'd probably have to disable temperature sensing on fan speed in the
BIOS.

It also ties into this thread because one of the other things I had to
do was quit simply putting it to sleep at night. I would come out and
find it sitting there waiting for me to input my passwords without the proper fans running as needed when it gets hot. I also installed and
use FanControl to keep it cool. Being a relatively new system, it does
fire up very quickly, so shutting it off does end the worry about it overheating during the night because it started up for an unknown
reason. I intended to check into and figure out what causes this, but
have just decided I'll shut if down at night and be done with the worry.

A 2-pin fan onto a 3-pin fan header, or Molex Y-adapter would have a fan
always running even in low-power mode. Only if power was removed from
the PSU (the 3VSB line remains active with ATX) would such a fan stop.
Maybe FanControl can do the same.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 9/3/2026 7:48 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

---snip--->> I failed to mention that I am also talking about a desktop.
The thread

on the fan upgrade can be seen in alt.comp.hardware explaining all the
difficulties. The main problem was this HP lives in the garage without
AC and I like to keep it running for various reasons. It gets hot so I
added a extra case fan, but no matter what settings I adjusted, I would
go out and it would be 30F warmer because of the system idling down the
fans.

There aren't header pins on the mobo for non-monitored and uncontrolled
fans that would run all the time at full speed?

---snip---

I have the situation all taken care of and it works nicely. I just
wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is
diminished when inactivity is noticed. I just didn't think I needed to
run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit, so I
found a workaround. I like you could give a crap if it saves a few
bucks. I get why they do it, I just don't like that as far as I could
tell, I couldn't stop it without doing something like I did.
--
Science Doesn’t Support Darwin. Scientists Do

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

sticks wrote:

I just wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is diminished when inactivity is noticed.  I just didn't think I needed to
run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit

The Core Ultra machines (toughbook equivalents) seem to live on a
knife-edge between lumpy performance and loud fans :-(
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 9/4/2026 4:06 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

sticks wrote:

I just wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is diminished when inactivity is noticed. 
I just didn't think I needed to run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit

The Core Ultra machines (toughbook equivalents) seem to live on a knife-edge between lumpy performance and loud fans :-(

I find the fan controls in the Big Machine BIOS work OK.
There are enough fans in the Big Machine, to move the curtains
on the other side of the room.

My Daily Driver doesn't need fan controls. That attests
to its gutless nature :-)

*******

Video cards, can have different policies on fan control.

Here, GPU-Z is used to display two cards, and show how the lower-end
card (1050ti) doesn't turn the fan on until the silicon die hits 60C.

[Picture] Low power 1050Ti and Mid power 1650 show their stuff

https://imgur.com/a/Run3yMH

https://postimg.cc/XBFDmVby
https://i.postimg.cc/fygn3Lq5/GPUZ-Fan-Behavior.gif

The other card, the fan is always spinning, and the cooler has
enough headroom, the card would survive if the computer
case was overheating inside.

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 9/4/2026 7:25 AM, Paul wrote:

On Fri, 9/4/2026 4:06 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

sticks wrote:

I just wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is diminished when inactivity is noticed.
I just didn't think I needed to run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit

The Core Ultra machines (toughbook equivalents) seem to live on a knife-edge between lumpy performance and loud fans :-(

I find the fan controls in the Big Machine BIOS work OK.
There are enough fans in the Big Machine, to move the curtains
on the other side of the room.

The BIOS in my machine was one of the problems. The higher end business models from the HP lineup have much better control over these things and
have BIOS options mine simply did not have. The only thermal option
mine had was a tab that showed the fan speed. No way to change or
control anything. The higher end boxes are able to use a program
directly from HP that would have done what I needed. But the lower cost motherboard and BIOS in mine eliminated that option.

In retrospect do I wish I would have spent the couple of hundred extra
bucks for the better box? Probably. I had a similar option with a
brand new laptop purchased for the wife. The higher end models give you
the option to stop battery charging at a certain level, much like a
current iPhone. Hers cannot do that. So instead she has to manually
monitor the charge and plug/unplug to try and get better battery life.

Moral of the story is yes, if you can afford it, get the better system.
There will be reasons the extra cost will be beneficial that get exposed
as time goes on.
--
Science Doesn’t Support Darwin. Scientists Do

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 9/4/2026 10:38 AM, sticks wrote:
---snip---

In retrospect do I wish I would have spent the couple of hundred extra
bucks for the better box?  Probably.  I had a similar option with a
brand new laptop purchased for the wife.  The higher end models give you the option to stop battery charging at a certain level, much like a
current iPhone.  Hers cannot do that.  So instead she has to manually monitor the charge and plug/unplug to try and get better battery life.

Moral of the story is yes, if you can afford it, get the better system. There will be reasons the extra cost will be beneficial that get exposed
as time goes on.

It also bothers me that this exposes the total hypocrisy of this woke
green scam. Manufacturers like to tout how all their stuff is so environmentally less harmful and good for the planet. In reality, they
don't do anything unless it is forced on them or it helps the bottom
line. It's business and they answer to shareholders. I accept that.
But, be honest about it.

The battery over charging issue that results in the early failure and necessary replacement of the laptop batteries is the perfect example.
The system already knows the charge of the battery and the mobo is in
control of the power supply. They have already solved the problem as
verified in the higher cost machines being able to set charging limits.
It is almost certain this can be solved with the right programming and software. But there is good money in batteries and they want you to not
only buy those, but also pay more for a machine that does. That is not
caring about the environment, that is a business decision that cares for profits. It's all lip service at this point.
--
Science Doesn’t Support Darwin. Scientists Do

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Paul wrote:

On Fri, 9/4/2026 4:06 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

sticks wrote:

I just wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is diminished when inactivity is noticed.
I just didn't think I needed to run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit

The Core Ultra machines (toughbook equivalents) seem to live on a knife-edge between lumpy performance and loud fans :-(

I find the fan controls in the Big Machine BIOS work OK.
There are enough fans in the Big Machine, to move the curtains
on the other side of the room.

My Daily Driver doesn't need fan controls. That attests
to its gutless nature :-)

These have been setup in an office environment, where people notice the
noise, once they've been deployed into fire engines, I doubt we'll get complaints about the noise ...

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2026-09-04 04:33, sticks wrote:

On 9/3/2026 7:48 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

---snip--->> I failed to mention that I am also talking about a desktop.
 The thread

on the fan upgrade can be seen in alt.comp.hardware explaining all the
difficulties.  The main problem was this HP lives in the garage without >>> AC and I like to keep it running for various reasons.  It gets hot so I >>> added a extra case fan, but no matter what settings I adjusted, I would
go out and it would be 30F warmer because of the system idling down the
fans.

There aren't header pins on the mobo for non-monitored and uncontrolled
fans that would run all the time at full speed?

---snip---

I have the situation all taken care of and it works nicely.  I just
wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is
diminished when inactivity is noticed.  I just didn't think I needed to
run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit, so I found a workaround.  I like you could give a crap if it saves a few bucks.  I get why they do it, I just don't like that as far as I could tell, I couldn't stop it without doing something like I did.

It would stand to reason that, depending on the hardware, it is never
possible to stop all the fans. Instead, fans would slow down to some low
speed that still moves some air.

And of course, not base the decision to stop the fans on "inactivity"
but on actual measured temps.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 9/4/2026 12:10 PM, sticks wrote:

On 9/4/2026 10:38 AM, sticks wrote:
---snip---

In retrospect do I wish I would have spent the couple of hundred extra bucks for the better box?  Probably.  I had a similar option with a brand new laptop purchased for the wife.  The higher end models give you the option to stop battery charging at a certain level, much like a current iPhone.  Hers cannot do that.  So instead she has to manually monitor the charge and plug/unplug to try and get better battery life.

Moral of the story is yes, if you can afford it, get the better system. There will be reasons the extra cost will be beneficial that get exposed as time goes on.

It also bothers me that this exposes the total hypocrisy of this woke green scam.  Manufacturers like to tout how all their stuff is so environmentally less harmful and good for the planet.  In reality, they don't do anything unless it is forced on them or it helps the bottom line.  It's business and they answer to shareholders.  I accept that. But, be honest about it.

The battery over charging issue that results in the early failure and necessary replacement of the laptop batteries is the perfect example. The system already knows the charge of the battery and the mobo is in control of the power supply.  They have already solved the problem as verified in the higher cost machines being able to set charging limits. It is almost certain this can be solved with the right programming and software.  But there is good money in batteries and they want you to not only buy those, but also pay more for a machine that does.  That is not caring about the environment, that is a business decision that cares for profits.  It's all lip service at this point.

There is some law in California regarding power consumption of PCs.
The idea is not to declare "open season" on the power network.
The power supply there is kinda tentative (some routed power lines,
start fires, they power off during wind storms so line slap against
trees does not start more fires). That's an example of a jurisdiction
that has something to say about PC design.

The laptop charging scheme, stopping at 80% is easy, as that is
the end of Phase 1. When you request to charge to 80%, the charger
is not doing Phase 2 (constant voltage, top-up) phase. It's not
necessarily "watched" as such, doesn't have to be. It could be
a setting on the charger chip to "don't do Phase 2". It might
even be a different charger chip. To stop at 60% or 70%, requires
some math and some watching (the metadata chip inside a battery pack,
stores info concerning how many charge cycles a pack has been through).

I agree that the 80% option, should be standard everywhere.
It's not likely to have a large BOM cost. But then, we have companies
using 30 year old silicon, just to save money (certain webcams that
should have been discontinued, are still made for $5 each). This is
how we have laptops with a webcam in the top edge of the panel, where
the image from the webcam is functionally useless. Definitely, nobody
cares about those. My laptop has one of those Prince of Darkness webcams.

On a laptop, the power usage can be trimmed to a certain level,
to cut down on fan noise. For example, a tablet is set to 2 watts,
so that the fanless tablet back does not "burn" someones lap. A
laptop with iGPU, the total package power is limited to a certain
value because the machine happens to only have the one fan. A gamer
laptop with discrete GPU added, can have two fans and air released
from the hinge area and behind the laptop. And that can be noisy.

It can also be difficult, to get information on the "tiny features"
of a laptop. Like whether it has an 80% option or not, is unlikely
to be in a spec sheet. When it really should be.

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 9/4/2026 12:31 PM, Andy Burns wrote:

Paul wrote:

On Fri, 9/4/2026 4:06 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

sticks wrote:

I just wanted to mention the additional win 11 issue where fan speed is diminished when inactivity is noticed.
I just didn't think I needed to run my CPU at the temps unnecessarily for the sake of eco bullshit

The Core Ultra machines (toughbook equivalents) seem to live on a knife-edge between lumpy performance and loud fans :-(

I find the fan controls in the Big Machine BIOS work OK.
There are enough fans in the Big Machine, to move the curtains
on the other side of the room.

My Daily Driver doesn't need fan controls. That attests
to its gutless nature :-)

These have been setup in an office environment, where people notice the noise, once they've been deployed into fire engines, I doubt we'll get complaints about the noise ...

Could you turn off Turbo (BIOS setting) ?

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 9/4/2026 12:38 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:

It would stand to reason that, depending on the hardware, it is never possible to stop all the fans.
Instead, fans would slow down to some low speed that still moves some air.

And of course, not base the decision to stop the fans on "inactivity" but on actual measured temps.

You can stop all fans.

They use CPU temperature, as an important metric.

When I did the test on the video cards, the
design that switches on the fan at 60C silicon die temperature,
switches the fan off again at 47C or so. There is
some hysteresis.

When an ordinary laptop sleeps, the SODIMMs are put in auto-refresh,
the dissipation is 1 watt per DIMM. And a number of other power
rails are disconnected, so there would be no drain in them. The
laptop can sleep quite a while on battery, but eventually it
relies on hibernation for retaining the session, as the battery
would eventually be empty. They would want the fan off, to reduce the power consumption.

The battery voltage is not allowed to drop too low. If the laptop
was sleeping, and the pack voltage was 14.8, the supply must be disconnected internally at say 12V. If the pack dropped below 8V, the charger would refuse to charge it, as there is a possibility of Lithium metal plate-out under reverse bias. That's one of the reasons I pop out the pack on my
old laptop, to reduce the self-discharge rate when it is not in
usage. Those may not be the exact right voltages, but that's just
to illustrate there are several key values in keeping a lithium
pack safe, over the lifetime of the pack.

Paul


--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11


Paul wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Paul wrote:

My Daily Driver doesn't need fan controls. That attests
to its gutless nature :-)

These have been setup in an office environment, where people notice

the noise, once they've been deployed into fire engines, I doubt
we'll get complaints about the noise ...

Could you turn off Turbo (BIOS setting) ?

Then the map zoom/scroll performance gets choppy ...

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Sat, 9/5/2026 2:29 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

Paul wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Paul wrote:

My Daily Driver doesn't need fan controls. That attests
to its gutless nature :-)

These have been setup in an office environment, where people notice

the noise, once they've been deployed into fire engines, I doubt
we'll get complaints about the noise ...

Could you turn off Turbo (BIOS setting) ?

Then the map zoom/scroll performance gets choppy ...

Like it's running on an E core instead of a P core perhaps ?
Is there a setting to turn off the E (efficiency) cores ? Just as an experiment.

The display needs contributions from two things, it needs
an iGPU with some amount of hardware acceleration to offer.
It also needs some CPU, to prepare things to feed the iGPU.
For example, I was running the SmokeParticle demo, and
it was consuming as much CPU as GPU, whereas other more
graphics heavy things, were railing the GPU. It could be,
that the "thing" preparing the map zoom/scroll is running
on an E core.

The power limiter on a laptop processor, measures
total package power, which is CPU power plus iGPU power.
Too much of one activity, can starve the other activity
a bit (reduce clock rate to stay within power envelope).

You would need a pretty fancy BIOS setup screen, to
try adjusting something like this.

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Paul wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Could you turn off Turbo (BIOS setting) ?

Then the map zoom/scroll performance gets choppy ...

Like it's running on an E core instead of a P core perhaps ?

I did tinker with core affinity when we had the non-ultra CPU models

Is there a setting to turn off the E (efficiency) cores ? Just as an experiment.

The display needs contributions from two things, it needs
an iGPU with some amount of hardware acceleration to offer.
It also needs some CPU, to prepare things to feed the iGPU.
For example, I was running the SmokeParticle demo, and
it was consuming as much CPU as GPU, whereas other more
graphics heavy things, were railing the GPU. It could be,
that the "thing" preparing the map zoom/scroll is running
on an E core.

I did force it to run on P-cores, there's "something about" the vendor's software, when it gets sent certain commands over the network, it ramps
up CPU usage and can take half an hour to calm down.

It has been explained to the non-techy project manager that throttling
will prevent the machine from self-harm ...

The power limiter on a laptop processor, measures
total package power, which is CPU power plus iGPU power.
Too much of one activity, can starve the other activity
a bit (reduce clock rate to stay within power envelope).

You would need a pretty fancy BIOS setup screen, to
try adjusting something like this.

Paul

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Sat, 9/5/2026 4:49 AM, Andy Burns wrote:

I did force it to run on P-cores, there's "something about" the vendor's software,
when it gets sent certain commands over the network, it ramps up CPU usage and can
take half an hour to calm down.

It has been explained to the non-techy project manager that throttling will prevent the machine from self-harm ...

Does the vendor software have value ?

My trigger finger would start to itch and
it would be nuke and pave time :-)

Maybe the activity was some sort of third
party AV on-demand scan.

Paul


--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2