• Microsoft patches 1,411 flaws and 3 0-days to make room for more

    From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Tue Oct 13 20:34:32 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This Patch Tuesday addresses 70 "Critical" vulnerabilities, 57 of which
    are remote code execution, 11 are elevation of privileges, and 2 are
    spoofing.

    The approximate number of bugs in each vulnerability category is listed
    below:

    677 Elevation of Privilege Vulnerabilities
    40 Security Feature Bypass Vulnerabilities
    317 Remote Code Execution Vulnerabilities
    254 Information Disclosure Vulnerabilities
    73 Denial of Service Vulnerabilities
    28 Spoofing Vulnerabilities
    When BleepingComputer reports on Patch Tuesday security updates, we only
    count vulnerabilities released by Microsoft on Patch Tuesday itself.

    Therefore, today's total excludes 348 flaws fixed earlier this month, including vulnerabilities in Azure API Center, Azure App Service, Azure
    Event Grid, Azure SRE Agent, Mariner, Microsoft Bookings, Microsoft
    Dataverse, Microsoft Exchange Server, and Microsoft Partner Center.

    This is a record-breaking Microsoft Patch Tuesday as Microsoft continues
    to use artificial intelligence platforms to find and remediate security vulnerabilities in its products.

    Microsoft announced today that Windows 11, version 24H2 Home and Pro,
    and Windows 10 Enterprise LTSB 2016 have reached end of support.

    "Today, October 13, 2026, Windows 11, version 24H2 Home and Pro, and
    Windows 10 Enterprise LTSB 2016 have reached end of updates. The October
    2026 monthly security update is the last update available for these
    editions," Microsoft said.

    Earlier this month, Microsoft also said organizations running Windows 11
    23H2 Enterprise, Education, and IoT Enterprise editions should upgrade
    to newer versions as they will no longer receive security updates
    starting next month.

    To learn more about the non-security updates released today, you can
    review our dedicated articles on the Windows 11 KB5127648 & KB5126653 cumulative updates and the Windows 10 KB5126657 extended security update.

    Microsoft patches 2 zero-days
    This month's Patch Tuesday fixes one actively exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    Microsoft classifies a zero-day flaw as publicly disclosed or actively exploited when no official fix is available.

    The actively exploited zero-day vulnerabilities addressed during this
    October 2026 Patch Tuesday are:

    CVE-2026-96951 - Windows Shell Security Feature Bypass Vulnerability

    Microsoft patched an actively exploited zero-day security bypass flaw
    that allowed attackers to bypass the Mark of the Web security feature.

    "Improper neutralization of special elements used in a command ('command injection') in Windows Shell allows an unauthorized attacker to bypass a security feature over a network," warns Microsoft.

    No details have been shared on how attackers exploited the flaw or who disclosed it.

    The two zero-days that were publicly disclosed are:

    CVE-2026-108398 - .NET Framework Security Feature Bypass Vulnerability

    Microsoft has fixed a security feature bypass in the .NET Framework that
    can be exploited to run unauthorized applications.

    "Untrusted search path in .NET Framework allows an authorized attacker
    to bypass a security feature locally," explains Microsoft.

    Microsoft says this flaw could allow attackers to bypass Windows
    Defender Application Control (WDAC) enforcement and run unauthorized applications.

    "An authenticated attacker could place a specially crafted .NET assembly
    on an affected system and register it for loading by a protected
    process." Microsoft says.

    "Successful exploitation could bypass Windows Defender Application
    Control restrictions and allow the attacker to execute code within the protected process. User interaction is not required."

    James Forshaw of Google Project Zero discovered the flaw.

    CVE-2026-92707 - MessagePack-CSharp Denial of Service Vulnerability

    Microsoft fixed a denial-of-service flaw in MessagePack-CSharp.

    "Improperly controlled sequential memory allocation in .NET allows an unauthorized attacker to deny service over a network," explains Microsoft.

    Microsoft has not shared who disclosed the vulnerability.

    Recent updates from other companies
    Other vendors who released updates or advisories in October 2026 include:

    Adobe released security updates for numerous products, including
    Commerce, Substance 3D Samples, ColdFusion, Photoshop, Dimension, and Framework.
    Atlassian released security updates for a critical vulnerability (CVE-2026-21589) in multiple self-hosted Data Center products, including Confluence, Jira, and Bitbucket. Attackers soon exploited the flaw after
    a PoC was released.
    Cisco released security updates for numerous products, including
    critical vulnerabilities in its NX-OS data center network operating
    system that can let attackers run arbitrary code with root privileges on
    Nexus switches.
    Citrix released security updates for NetScaler ADC and NetScaler Gateway flaws, with CVE-2026-88779 exploited in zero-day attacks before it was patched.
    Dell released security updates for critical vulnerabilities in the
    System Update (DSU) command-line interface (CLI) deployment tool and
    Container Storage Modules (CSM).
    Docker patched a critical flaw in DockerHub that lets attackers
    impersonate users and push images from others' repositories.
    Fortinet released security updates for numerous products, including a
    critical FortiMail vulnerability (CVE-2026-104286) that attackers
    exploited in zero-day attacks.
    GitLab released security updates for critical flaws in AI Gateway and
    CI/CD Regular Expression Compiler.
    Ivanti released security updates for an actively exploited zero-day vulnerability in the Ivanti Connect Secure (ICS) remote access gateway. Kiteworks released security updates for 126 vulnerabilities, including a max-severity flaw affecting its Email Protection Gateway (EPG) security solution.
    Progress Software released security updates for critical and high
    security vulnerabilities in MarkLogic Server.
    SAP released the October security updates, addressing 20 security flaws, including a maximum-severity OAuth2 SSRF vulnerability in Cloud SDK for Python.
    SonicWall released security updates for a critical SMA1000 server-side
    request forgery (SSRF) flaw, which attackers exploited within two days.
    New risk cohorts help prioritize security updates
    With this month's record-breaking number of vulnerabilities, Microsoft
    has also introduced a new method for organizations to prioritize
    security updates by grouping related flaws into what it calls "risk
    cohorts."

    The new approach groups similar vulnerabilities together to help
    organizations better understand which security flaws pose the greatest
    risk to their systems and should be prioritized for patching.

    For October 2026, Microsoft published 15 risk cohorts, including:

    136 vulnerabilities affecting Windows filesystems, storage, and backup.

    135 vulnerabilities involving Office documents and mail clients.

    131 vulnerabilities affecting Windows graphics, media, and content
    processing.

    109 vulnerabilities involving Windows core and kernel privilege boundaries.

    103 vulnerabilities affecting Windows installation, deployment, and
    update services.

    Microsoft stressed that these groups do not necessarily indicate which
    flaws are the most dangerous, as the actual risk depends on whether they
    are being exploited in attacks, their severity, and how an organization
    uses the affected software.

    Microsoft says the new approach is still experimental and is meant to
    help organizations prioritize security updates, not replace its existing patching recommendations.

    Microsoft has published a PDF mapping the October 2026 vulnerabilities
    to their respective risk cohorts.
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot

    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Alan K.@alan@invalid.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Tue Oct 13 21:09:49 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort? I'd like to think so.
    --
    Mint 22.3, Thunderbird 153.4.0esr, Firefox 157.0.1
    Alan K.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Paul@nospam@needed.invalid to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Tue Oct 13 23:29:47 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Tue, 10/13/2026 9:09 PM, Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd like to think so.


    "Microsoft October 2026 Patch Tuesday fixes 1,411 flaws, 3 zero-days"

    https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/microsoft-october-2026-patch-tuesday-fixes-1-411-flaws-3-zero-days/

    By Lawrence Abrams October 13, 2026

    Amazing. Even the deck chairs have changed colors.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Tom Elam@thomas.e.elam@gmail.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Wed Oct 14 11:27:16 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/13/26 9:09 PM, Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd like
    to think so.

    I realize that copy/paste is a major time and effort issue for you, but
    it is really pretty quick and easy for most of us. If the link ever goes
    away the content is now here for all to see.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Wed Oct 14 11:50:41 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd like
    to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    If you _only_ wanted the quote, tell yourself that whenever I provided
    just that, people complained that they wanted the whole article to avoid venturing onto a web page. You're damned if you do, and you're damned if
    you don't.
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Tom Elam@thomas.e.elam@gmail.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Wed Oct 14 18:30:23 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/14/26 11:50 AM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd
    like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    If you _only_ wanted the quote, tell yourself that whenever I provided
    just that, people complained that they wanted the whole article to avoid venturing onto a web page. You're damned if you do, and you're damned if
    you don't.

    Not true for Alan Faker. No matter what, he will find a way to be
    unbelievably negative. He once posted "I just like to pick fights" or
    some such in this very newsgroup.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Paul@nospam@needed.invalid to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Wed Oct 14 20:02:32 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Wed, 10/14/2026 11:50 AM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    If you _only_ wanted the quote, tell yourself that whenever I provided just that, people complained that they wanted the whole article to avoid venturing onto a web page. You're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't.


    The shorturl does not support a standard preview option.

    Do you know if it has a preview option ?

    For example preview.tinyurl.com is one method. It doesn't support that
    method, of putting preview in front of the domain.

    Or for other link shorteners, putting a "+" on the end is a preview.
    It doesn't support that either.

    If you present the preview format, then nobody can complain.
    Otherwise, there's really no reason (on USENET) to be
    using a link shortener, because it implies you want to
    hide an exploit you're going to try in a browser.

    While a USENET post has a ~1000 character limit for line length,
    using the continuation character, you can make lines which are
    logically longer than that. Someone once posted a million digits of
    PI, as a single line, with continuation characters on the end of each one.
    You can easily store a URL in such a capability as that.

    This is why I posted the link for Alan, so it would be plaintext
    and could be analyzed for trust by the audience.

    https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/microsoft-october-2026-patch-tuesday-fixes-1-411-flaws-3-zero-days/

    <https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/microsoft-october-2026-patch-tuesday-fixes-1-411-flaws-3-zero-days/>

    Whether you put the crap on the ends of it, doesn't matter.

    Paul

    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Carlos E.R.@robin_listas@es.invalid to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 21:42:05 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-14 17:50, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd
    like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    No, that's not the link.

    I never open shortlinks, they can be malware.
    --
    Cheers, Carlos.
    ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 17:30:26 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-15 3:42 p.m., Carlos E.R. wrote:
    On 2026-10-14 17:50, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates >>>> addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.



    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd
    like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    No, that's not the link.

    I never open shortlinks, they can be malware.

    That's not a bad approach.
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Joel W. Crump@joelcrump@gmail.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 17:39:41 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/15/2026 5:30 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-15 3:42 p.m., Carlos E.R. wrote:
    On 2026-10-14 17:50, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates >>>>> addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd
    like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    No, that's not the link.

    I never open shortlinks, they can be malware.

    That's not a bad approach.


    If I navigate to a bad site, Norton blocks me, I honestly think it's
    worth having over Microsoft Defender. I consider a Win11 PC to be
    mostly carefree but with that solid antimalware package in place, it
    gives me a reassurance.
    --
    Joel W. Crump
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Brock McNuggets@brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 15:46:27 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Oct 15, 2026 at 2:39 PM, Joel W. Crump wrote in 11arh70$2pp06$1@dont-email.me:
    On 10/15/2026 5:30 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-15 3:42 p.m., Carlos E.R. wrote:
    <snip 18 lines>

    That's not a bad approach.


    If I navigate to a bad site, Norton blocks me, I honestly think it's
    worth having over Microsoft Defender. I consider a Win11 PC to be
    mostly carefree but with that solid antimalware package in place, it
    gives me a reassurance.

    Windows has gotten better but a good malware detector is still wise.
    --
    It's impossible for someone who is at war with themselves to be at
    peace with you.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 20:07:11 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-15 5:39 p.m., Joel W. Crump wrote:
    On 10/15/2026 5:30 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-15 3:42 p.m., Carlos E.R. wrote:
    On 2026-10-14 17:50, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security
    updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd >>>>> like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    No, that's not the link.

    I never open shortlinks, they can be malware.

    That's not a bad approach.


    If I navigate to a bad site, Norton blocks me, I honestly think it's
    worth having over Microsoft Defender.  I consider a Win11 PC to be
    mostly carefree but with that solid antimalware package in place, it
    gives me a reassurance.

    I also think that having a decent additional level of protection is a
    good idea on any computer I own. Nevertheless, I see no point of adding
    that kind of stuff to a Mac.
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Joel W. Crump@joelcrump@gmail.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 20:30:08 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/15/2026 8:07 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:

    If I navigate to a bad site, Norton blocks me, I honestly think it's
    worth having over Microsoft Defender.  I consider a Win11 PC to be
    mostly carefree but with that solid antimalware package in place, it
    gives me a reassurance.

    I also think that having a decent additional level of protection is a
    good idea on any computer I own. Nevertheless, I see no point of adding
    that kind of stuff to a Mac.


    It's specifically because I'm running Winblows, that I'm doing it, yeah.
    It's part of the cash that goes toward "the cloud" as it were. But
    they did give me a discount, at least.
    --
    Joel W. Crump
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Nick Charles@none@none.none to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 01:26:26 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news.

    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in the industry".

    It is to laugh.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Joel W. Crump@joelcrump@gmail.com to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 21:27:57 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/15/2026 9:26 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news.

    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in the industry".

    It is to laugh.


    As if Apple is so perfect?
    --
    Joel W. Crump
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Maria Sophia@mariasophia@comprehension.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 18:42:53 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    Joel W. Crump wrote:
    If I navigate to a bad site, Norton blocks me, I honestly think it's
    worth having over Microsoft Defender.  I consider a Win11 PC to be
    mostly carefree but with that solid antimalware package in place, it
    gives me a reassurance.

    I also think that having a decent additional level of protection is a
    good idea on any computer I own. Nevertheless, I see no point of adding
    that kind of stuff to a Mac.


    It's specifically because I'm running Winblows, that I'm doing it, yeah.
    It's part of the cash that goes toward "the cloud" as it were. But
    they did give me a discount, at least.

    Is this thread about bugs? Or malware?
    This is an INTELLIGENT thread on a huge number of Windows "bugs", right?

    The person who said "I see no point of adding that kind of stuff to a Mac"
    is a known religious zealot nutcase, but I wonder where he gets his data?
    a. A bug is a flaw in software, right?
    b. Malware is software aimed for malicious intent.

    Occam's Razor, right?
    *They're not the same thing* (even as the end result might sometimes be).

    To keep this discussion at the INTELLIGENT level, and not an Apple
    marketing endorsement (which is what the religious zealots do), I'd look at what Apple does that is DIFFERENT from what Windows does, for those two.

    For example:
    *Protecting against malware in macOS*
    <https://support.apple.com/guide/security/protecting-against-malware-sec469d47bd8/web>

    Those don't seem to protect against bugs.
    a. Gatekeeper and notarization don't detect bugs
    b. Xprotect only detects known malware, not bugs
    c. System Integrity Protection protects from changes in system files

    The INTELLIGENT question to ask, is doesn't Windows have the same things?
    <https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/learning-center/windows-11-security-features>
    --
    Most people religiously believe as gospel everything Apple marketing spews.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Maria Sophia@mariasophia@comprehension.com to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 19:07:53 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    Joel W. Crump wrote:
    On 10/15/2026 9:26 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >>
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news. >>
    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and
    based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in >> the industry".

    It is to laugh.


    As if Apple is so perfect?

    Joel's response is apropos, IMHO, in that Apple software has as many or
    more zero-day holes and bugs as any other software, despite what is
    arguably the most brilliant marketing pitch on the planet by Apple.

    *We prevent you from doing anything - which we say - keeps you safe!*

    For some reason, people believe that since Apple devices can't do half of
    what every other device does, somehow (magically?) that keeps them safe.

    It's like a butterknife is 'safer' for cutting trees than a chainsaw.
    *Comparing iOS/macOS to Android/Windows is a similar comparison*

    Apple's (rather brilliant) marketing pitch is:
    * Hey, we know you can't do anything useful on our devices
    * But that keeps you safer!

    Despite Apple's claim of "safety thru inability", CISA says otherwise:
    <https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>

    Nonetheless, if we wish to have an INTELLIGENT discussion on the sheer
    number of bugs fixed per any given time period, that's maybe worthwhile.

    You have to admit, the recent numbers sure are lower, but we have to look
    at the time periods and the fact that Apple's QA is known to be atrocious.
    *Apple Patches 200 Vulnerabilities With New iOS 27, macOS Golden Gate 27 Releases*
    <https://www.securityweek.com/apple-patches-200-vulnerabilities-with-new-ios-27-macos-golden-gate-27-releases/>
    "The updates resolve kernel vulnerabilities that could lead to
    memory corruption, privilege escalation, system termination,
    and information leaks. Approximately 100 of the resolved security
    defects affect both the mobile and desktop operating systems.
    The fixes target more than 90 platform components, including
    AppleKeyStore, Authentication Services, Foundation, Safe Browsing,
    Sandbox, Security, TCC, and WebKit."

    I've been studying the typical Apple poster to Usenet for decades.
    They're not like normal people. That's for sure.

    They've invested tremendously in the Apple marketing mystique.
    And they'll defend it to the death, no matter what.
    Using ht efirst absurd excuse that comes to their mind.

    For some reason, they think 200 bugs is better than 1400, and, well, if
    bugs were that simple, it would be... but they're not that simple.

    A lot depends on the bugs that Apple's QA missed, given Google proved Apple doesn't test huge portions of their code so, that makes s difference.
    <https://cyberscoop.com/iphone-hack-google-project-zero/>

    But even if Apple did test their code even once, their QA is so bad that
    small children find huge holes in their software (e.g., Facetime).

    And even so, the sheer *number* of bugs in Apple software isn't known fron
    only one release, just as it's not known from one Windows update either.

    What does matter though, which most Apple owners have no clue about, is
    Apple has NEVER fully patched anything but the current release. <https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/apple-clarifies-security-update-policy-only-the-latest-oses-are-fully-patched/>
    <https://screenrant.com/apple-product-security-update-lifespan/> <https://hothardware.com/news/apple-admits-only-fully-patches-security-flaws-in-latest-os-releases>

    That's IMPORTANT given Windows does fully patch multiple releases.
    In fact, I think ONLY APPLE does not fully patch prior releases.

    So, an INTELLIGENT question to ask of the team is:
    Q: Is it ONLY APPLE that never fully patches older releases?
    A: ?
    --
    Most people can't process even simple things that they do not understand.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Nick Charles@none@none.none to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 02:36:48 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Oct 15, 2026 at 9:27:57 PM EDT, ""Joel W. Crump"" <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

    On 10/15/2026 9:26 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >>
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news. >>
    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and
    based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in >> the industry".

    It is to laugh.


    As if Apple is so perfect?

    When did I say that?

    The fact is, TWO flaws is WAY better than 1,400. Right?

    STILL laughable.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Maria Sophia@mariasophia@comprehension.com to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 19:50:34 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    Nick Charles wrote:
    As if Apple is so perfect?

    When did I say that?

    The fact is, TWO flaws is WAY better than 1,400. Right?

    STILL laughable.

    If the goal is an INTELLIGENT conversation, I must ask the simple question:

    Q: Why would ANYONE think there are only 2 fixes in recent Apple releases?
    A: ?

    As just a single example of far more, Zero Day Initiative's September 2026 review counted 273 unique CVEs across Apple's September releases alone.
    <https://www.zerodayinitiative.com/blog/2026/9/16/the-apple-security-update-review-for-september-2026>
    <https://glennmcgui.re/apple-cve/>
    --
    Note: Apple religious zealots try to defend Apple to the death, no matter
    what, always using the first absurd excuse that pops into their heads.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Joel W. Crump@joelcrump@gmail.com to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Thu Oct 15 23:06:31 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 10/15/2026 10:36 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 15, 2026 at 9:27:57 PM EDT, ""Joel W. Crump"" <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:
    On 10/15/2026 9:26 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >>>
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates >>>> addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news. >>>
    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and
    based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in
    the industry".

    It is to laugh.

    As if Apple is so perfect?

    When did I say that?

    The fact is, TWO flaws is WAY better than 1,400. Right?

    STILL laughable.


    I will admit that Microsoft leaves itself wide open to this.
    --
    Joel W. Crump
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Paul@nospam@needed.invalid to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 06:47:56 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Thu, 10/15/2026 10:36 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 15, 2026 at 9:27:57 PM EDT, ""Joel W. Crump"" <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

    On 10/15/2026 9:26 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >>>
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates >>>> addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news. >>>
    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and
    based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in
    the industry".

    It is to laugh.


    As if Apple is so perfect?

    When did I say that?

    The fact is, TWO flaws is WAY better than 1,400. Right?

    STILL laughable.


    These are automated scans. Apple will be doing these too.

    The benefit of automated scans, is they don't get tired, they
    can review the same code, again and again. Humans can only
    do that so much, without mental fatigue.

    At some point, the search for defects reaches an asymptote.
    Whether it is humans searching for these, or machines searching
    for these, it's damn hard to get to 100%. It might take a
    code functional freeze, and a couple years of analysis at NASA,
    to make a reasonably bulletproof piece of code. And these
    aren't necessarily big modules, either.

    For more conventional coding efforts, the slop level is almost by design.
    Using fast prototyping, at work we would be throwing code over
    the wall to the Test Group, faster than they could test it. That's
    like a "guaranteed train wreck" of a methodology. That's part of
    the source of your defects. But if you don't use techniques like that,
    then the CEO is complaining your "five lines of tested code per day",
    is not good enough. We even had one manager, making fun of that
    statistic, by writing 1500 lines of code in a single day,
    a formless unstructured gag-me module that proved nothing.
    But I can tell you it made him feel good, that he was "300x as productive"
    as the "average dev". And it's those people that give you 1400 flaws
    fixed in one month, as you stamp his workmanship out of existence.

    Summary: The number is not important, as the real number is 50,000.
    The curve of the numbers found will settle, until it gets to the
    noise level. Whether companies are measuring the same thing,
    quoting real numbers, or cheating, all that matters is that
    they be consistent, and any evidence of a shift in detection rate,
    is a sign of a new technology. The actual problem, has not gone
    away. Complexity, and large large code bases, are the problem.
    and you never ever get to zero. If the indicator dial indicates
    zero, you aren't smart enough to find the remaining ones. Every
    month, you introduce 100 more of those flaws... just by messing
    around and opening source code files.

    Paul
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 08:04:10 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-15 9:26 p.m., Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news? This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws. THAT will be news.

    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in the industry".

    It is to laugh.

    One of the things I needed to get used to in migrating to the Mac is the
    fact that I am not asked to restart to apply an update very often. Some
    might see that as a security problem; others will see it as evidence
    that there is little to fix. Whichever side you agree with, the reality
    is that you don't hear Mac users complaining that their identity was
    stolen, or that their data was lost because some malware encrypted their personal files. When there is malware for the Mac, it is usually the
    result of someone venturing onto a site that shares pirated software. In
    a way, those users totally deserve it.
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4 Sky Blue
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 08:06:12 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-15 9:27 p.m., Joel W. Crump wrote:
    On 10/15/2026 9:26 PM, Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >>
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news?   This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws.   THAT will be
    news.

    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO
    flaws and
    based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst
    security in
    the industry".

    It is to laugh.

    As if Apple is so perfect?
    Give us your detailed list of Apple failures. I'll get you started:

    iTunes Ping
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4 Sky Blue
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Paul@nospam@needed.invalid to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 10:01:20 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Fri, 10/16/2026 8:04 AM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-15 9:26 p.m., Nick Charles wrote:
    On Oct 13, 2026 at 8:34:32 PM EDT, "CrudeSausage" <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >>
    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    This is supposed to be news?   This is just another day for MS.

    Let us know when MS is NOT fixing thousands of flaws.   THAT will be news. >>
    Because as you noted, there will always be more.

    Meanwhile, there is a dumbass here complaining that Apple fixed TWO flaws and
    based on that - get this - is claiming that Apple has "the worst security in >> the industry".

    It is to laugh.

    One of the things I needed to get used to in migrating to the Mac is the fact that I am not asked to restart to apply an update very often. Some might see that as a security problem; others will see it as evidence that there is little to fix. Whichever side you agree with, the reality is that you don't hear Mac users complaining that their identity was stolen, or that their data was lost because some malware encrypted their personal files. When there is malware for the Mac, it is usually the result of someone venturing onto a site that shares pirated software. In a way, those users totally deserve it.


    Smugness is not a replacement for Safe Hex.

    You may not have noticed, but "the Black Hats are winning".

    Some of the exploits recorded on popular web sites, mention
    that "researchers do not know how the pest got inside the machine".
    They don't actually know for certain, what the attack surface was,
    they just see some of the behavior after it gets there.

    This means, even when a platform is smug, people at the dev level
    are losing a handle on how the attacks are taking place. Are they coming
    in via the web browser ? Via execution of unsafe code ? They don't know.

    Most of the time, machines rely on signature analysis and the handling
    of polymorphic cases, to block things. Lots of third party AV tools
    don't have heuristic protection (defense mechanisms for malware that
    has never been seen before). Heuristic protection is a suite of individual methods, hand crafted by single smart persons at those companies. It's
    a hard-won feature set. That's why a lot of wannabie AV products
    don't have that. Malwarebytes, they started off their business,
    using nothing but heuristic detection, only later having the money
    to hire people to build a signature database. The AV-Comparatives website provides benchmarks for some of this. You could check the AV-Comparatives website, to see if Apple receives any mention there (I'm not going to check).

    Some of the protection, is in places like the browser itself. There is
    some stack smashing detection code in Firefox. Since Firefox runs on
    3+ platforms, that code would need to be adjusted for the differences in platforms. It's not only the OS that has code like that.

    Microsoft needs a reboot for every Patch Tuesday security update,
    because the kernel is updated every month (that's issue based updating,
    it's not done as a "bad habit"). For the .NET update, it's
    in less of a hurry for something like that. The items in Windows Update
    are marked as to whether they need a reboot... or not. The kernel file
    is one of the "frequent" items in the Security updates.

    *******

    "Sep 27, 2021

    It is simple. You cannot upgrade linux kernel without rebooting.
    At least not in a way you would think.

    There are technologies like systemtap, dtrace, kpatch or kgraft which allows
    small modifications of kernel code. These are meant as short workarounds to
    stop security threat typically to give you more time until you plan an outage
    for reboot. People confuse this with rebooting a new kernel, it is totally not that.

    You will have to reboot at some point. Design your infrastructure for that.
    "

    So that's how Linux handles patching the kernel, on a temporary basis.

    Paul

    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Maria Sophia@mariasophia@comprehension.com to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 09:33:47 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    Paul wrote:
    The number is not important, as the real number is 50,000.

    Not only the number, but the seriousness of each bug is what matters most.

    Paul has the correct response to the "why only 2" that the Apple religious zealot asked, where we must note the religious zealot actually *believes*
    there were only 2 bugs in all of Apple's releases compared to 1400 in
    Windows.

    I won't belabor how absurd that is, other than to say this thread was
    *opened* by an Apple religious zealot expressly to point out that poor
    Windows has 1400 bugs while Apple has... hmmm... they simply didn't say.

    What is notable, always, is the Apple user is desperate to claim some "advantage" over Windows, even as they have to fabricate that advantage.

    Although... I must note... I too am shocked at the 1400 figure, but I don't keep track of this stuff day to day. Is 1400 a normal number for Windows?

    Dunno.
    Does anyone?

    Why 1400 this time?
    Is that a typical amount for Windows?

    If not, what is the typical amount?
    (e.g., Apple's last bug count was over 200).
    --
    On Usenet, Apple religious zealots try to defend Apple to the death,
    no matter what, always using the first absurd excuse they can imagine.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Truth in Writing@OnlyTruthMatters@is.invalid to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 16:38:30 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    As of Fri, 16 Oct 2026 08:06:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote:
    Give us your detailed list of Apple failures. I'll get you started:

    iTunes Ping

    Here's a historically grounded list of Apple products, services, and initiatives that failed, underperformed, or were discontinued. "Failure" is relative: some were commercial flops; others were useful experiments that
    never found a lasting audience.
    Clear flops or short-lived products

    iTunes Ping (2010-2012) - Apple's attempt at a music-focused social
    network. It struggled to attract users and meaningful artist participation,
    and was shut down after two years.
    Apple Maps' 2012 launch - The initial release had serious problems with directions, place data, and mapping accuracy. Apple apologized and replaced
    the executive in charge; the service itself improved and remains active. MobileMe (2008-2012) - Apple's paid suite of email, contacts, calendar, and file-sync services launched with major reliability and synchronization problems. Apple apologized, extended subscriptions, and eventually replaced
    it with iCloud.
    Apple Newton MessagePad (1993-1998) - An ambitious handheld computer whose handwriting recognition became a punchline, though the Newton also had
    devoted users and influenced later mobile devices.
    Apple Pippin (1996-1997) - A multimedia/game console platform licensed to
    third parties. It was expensive, had a small software library, and sold
    poorly.
    Apple Bandai Pippin - The best-known Pippin system, launched in a market dominated by Sony, Nintendo, and Sega. It failed to gain meaningful
    traction.
    Macintosh TV (1993) - A black Mac that could also display television, but offered an awkward combination of computer and TV features at a high price
    and sold in very small numbers.
    Apple III (1980-1984) - A business computer plagued by reliability and thermal-design problems. Early machines were especially failure-prone, and
    the product never became a major success.
    Lisa (1983-1986) - A technically groundbreaking graphical computer, but its very high price and limited software market kept sales low. The later
    Macintosh made it largely redundant.
    Twentieth Anniversary Macintosh (1997) - A lavish, limited-edition Mac that
    was far too expensive for its performance and arrived as Apple was
    struggling financially. Its price was eventually cut sharply.
    eWorld (1994-1996) - Apple's online service, competing with CompuServe and
    AOL. It was polished but expensive, Mac-centric, and unable to build a
    large subscriber base.
    Cyberdog (1996-1997) - Apple's internet software suite for the classic Mac
    OS. It was discontinued before it could become a mainstream product.
    QuickTake cameras (1994-1997) - Among the earliest consumer digital
    cameras, but quickly outpaced by competitors and discontinued after Apple's camera business was sold.
    Apple USB Mouse / "hockey puck" mouse (1998-2000) - The round shape made it difficult for many people to orient and use comfortably. Apple replaced it
    with a more conventional design.
    Apple Pro Mouse (2000-2005) - Its clear shell and touch-sensitive button
    were distinctive, but the lack of a scroll wheel frustrated many users.
    Later versions added scrolling.
    iPod Hi-Fi (2006-2007) - A premium speaker dock for the iPod. Its high
    price and limited features made it difficult to compete with less expensive speaker systems.
    iPod shuffle, third generation (2009-2010) - It removed the device's
    physical controls and relied on inline headphone controls and spoken menus. Apple restored buttons in the next model.
    iPod nano, seventh generation (2012-2017) - A capable small music player,
    but it arrived as smartphones were absorbing the dedicated music-player
    market. The nano line was discontinued.
    iPod touch, final generation (2019-2022) - It remained useful as a low-cost
    iOS device, but its aging hardware and shrinking role in a phone-centered market led Apple to discontinue it.

    Services and software that didn't last

    Apple's social-networking efforts - Ping was the clearest example, but
    Apple repeatedly tried to add social features to music and media products without building a durable social platform.
    iTunes LP (2009-2018) - A digital-album format with liner notes, videos,
    and other extras. It never became a standard way to buy music and was eventually phased out.
    iTunes Extras for music albums - Bonus material attached to digital albums never became a major selling point for most customers.
    MobileMe Gallery and iDisk - Features of MobileMe that were discontinued as Apple shifted toward iCloud's simpler storage and photo-syncing model.
    Ping's successor social features in iTunes - Apple continued experimenting
    with artist pages, sharing, and recommendations, but none recreated the engagement of dedicated social platforms.
    Apple's "Ping" integration with Facebook and Twitter - The idea that users would share music activity from inside iTunes did not overcome the fact
    that people already used general-purpose social networks.
    iTunes Radio (2013-2016) - The ad-supported radio service was folded into
    Apple Music. It had a limited footprint and struggled to stand out against established streaming services.
    Beats Music (2014-2015 as a standalone service) - Apple bought Beats and
    its streaming service, but retired the standalone app and migrated the
    service into Apple Music.
    Apple Music Connect (2015-2018) - A social feature for artists to post
    directly to fans. It failed to become a compelling destination and was
    removed.
    Apple's original TV app strategy - For years, Apple TV hardware and
    software did not deliver the all-in-one television experience many
    expected. The product survived, but the broader ambition repeatedly fell
    short of expectations.
    Apple TV+'s early library strategy - The service launched with a small
    slate of original shows and no large back catalog. That was a weakness at launch, even though the service later expanded.
    iAd (2010-2016) - Apple's mobile advertising network failed to win enough advertisers and publishers to compete effectively. Apple shut it down.
    Apple Maps Connect / business-listing tools - Apple has repeatedly had to improve how businesses manage their information in Maps, reflecting the difficulty of maintaining accurate local listings at scale.

    Hardware and product-line misfires

    Power Mac G4 Cube (2000-2001) - Beautifully designed and technically interesting, but expensive, less expandable than a tower, and not powerful enough for its price. Apple suspended production after weak sales.
    PowerBook 5300 (1995) - A high-profile laptop family troubled by
    reliability issues, including battery and component problems, damaging its reputation.
    Power Mac G4 Cube's acrylic case - The case was striking but prone to
    visible cracking, adding to customer concerns about an already niche
    product.
    Macintosh Portable (1989-1991) - A large, heavy, expensive portable Mac.
    Its weight and price made it a poor fit for the "portable" promise.
    20th Anniversary Macintosh - Also worth mentioning separately from the
    broader anniversary line: its luxury design could not compensate for its
    poor value.
    Apple eMate 300 (1997-1998) - A Newton-based laptop aimed at education. It
    was discontinued when Apple ended the Newton platform.
    Apple QuickTake - Apple's early digital-camera line was a pioneering
    effort, but it could not compete with the pace of the camera market.
    Apple's licensed Mac-clone program (1995-1997) - It produced some
    well-regarded machines, but Apple concluded it was cannibalizing Mac sales
    and ended the program.
    Macintosh Performa line (1990s) - A confusing sprawl of overlapping models
    and inconsistent naming made it hard for buyers to understand Apple's
    lineup. Apple later simplified its product range.
    Apple's early consumer desktop experiments - Models such as the Performa
    and several low-end Macs suffered from confusing positioning and frequent revisions, rather than one single catastrophic product failure.
    Apple Watch Edition in solid gold (2015-2016) - The $10,000-plus luxury
    version was discontinued after one generation. The broader Apple Watch succeeded; the gold version did not become a lasting product category.
    AirPower (announced 2017, canceled 2019) - Apple announced a wireless
    charging mat that could charge multiple devices in flexible positions, then canceled it after failing to meet its standards.
    Apple Car / Project Titan (roughly 2014-2024) - Apple spent years exploring
    an electric and autonomous vehicle, but never announced a product and ultimately ended the project.
    Apple's rumored television set - A full Apple-branded TV was widely
    anticipated but never shipped. Apple instead pursued the Apple TV box and
    TV app.
    HomePod (first generation, 2018-2021) - The original speaker was praised
    for sound quality but criticized for its high price, limited smart-home ecosystem, and narrow service support. Apple discontinued it, then later revived the HomePod line with a new model.
    HomePod mini's original Siri limitations - The hardware found a broader audience, but Siri's capabilities and smart-home reliability lagged expectations. That's a product weakness, not a failure of the mini itself. Apple Vision Pro's initial market performance - The first headset was an expensive, niche product with limited everyday use cases. It is too early
    to call the platform a definitive failure, but the launch did not resemble
    a mass-market hit.

    Strategic bets that didn't work as intended

    Apple's dependence on the Macintosh in the 1990s - The Mac remained
    important, but Apple's shrinking market share, confusing product lineup,
    and financial troubles showed that the strategy was not sustainable in its then-current form.
    The Copland operating-system project (1994-1996) - Apple's attempt to build
    a modern Mac OS replacement collapsed under delays and technical
    complexity. Apple canceled it and eventually acquired NeXT, whose
    technology became the basis for Mac OS X.
    Taligent - A joint Apple-IBM-Motorola effort to build a next-generation operating system and software framework. It failed to deliver the promised platform and was wound down.
    Pink - An earlier Apple initiative for a next-generation operating system.
    It was spun into Taligent and never became the successor to the classic Mac
    OS.
    OpenDoc - A component-based software architecture promoted by Apple and partners. It failed to gain broad developer adoption and was discontinued. Cyberdog and OpenDoc together - Cyberdog was meant to showcase OpenDoc, but
    the platform's complexity and limited ecosystem prevented either from
    taking off.
    Apple's early PDA strategy - The Newton was innovative, but Apple did not
    turn it into a durable, dominant product line before the market shifted. Apple's first online-services strategy - eWorld and related services failed
    to compete with larger, more established networks.
    Apple's attempt to make iTunes the center of all digital media - iTunes was enormously influential, but its increasingly crowded desktop app became cumbersome and was eventually split into separate Mac apps.

    Important caveats

    Discontinued doesn't always mean failed. The iPod, for example, was a huge success whose role diminished as the iPhone took over.
    A product can fail commercially and still matter technically. The Newton,
    Lisa, and QuickTake helped establish ideas that became more successful
    later.
    Some entries are mixed cases. Apple Maps had a disastrous launch but
    recovered; HomePod's first generation was discontinued, but the product category returned; Vision Pro's long-term outcome is still unsettled.
    Apple has also had many quiet cancellations that never became public
    products, so the list is necessarily incomplete .
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From CrudeSausage@crude@sausa.ge to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 13:02:12 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-16 12:38 p.m., Truth in Writing wrote:
    As of Fri, 16 Oct 2026 08:06:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote:
    Give us your detailed list of Apple failures. I'll get you started:

    iTunes Ping

    Here's a historically grounded list of Apple products, services, and initiatives that failed, underperformed, or were discontinued. "Failure" is relative: some were commercial flops; others were useful experiments that never found a lasting audience.
    Clear flops or short-lived products

    iTunes Ping (2010-2012) - Apple's attempt at a music-focused social
    network. It struggled to attract users and meaningful artist participation, and was shut down after two years.
    Apple Maps' 2012 launch - The initial release had serious problems with directions, place data, and mapping accuracy. Apple apologized and replaced the executive in charge; the service itself improved and remains active. MobileMe (2008-2012) - Apple's paid suite of email, contacts, calendar, and file-sync services launched with major reliability and synchronization problems. Apple apologized, extended subscriptions, and eventually replaced it with iCloud.
    Apple Newton MessagePad (1993-1998) - An ambitious handheld computer whose handwriting recognition became a punchline, though the Newton also had devoted users and influenced later mobile devices.
    Apple Pippin (1996-1997) - A multimedia/game console platform licensed to third parties. It was expensive, had a small software library, and sold poorly.
    Apple Bandai Pippin - The best-known Pippin system, launched in a market dominated by Sony, Nintendo, and Sega. It failed to gain meaningful
    traction.
    Macintosh TV (1993) - A black Mac that could also display television, but offered an awkward combination of computer and TV features at a high price and sold in very small numbers.
    Apple III (1980-1984) - A business computer plagued by reliability and thermal-design problems. Early machines were especially failure-prone, and the product never became a major success.
    Lisa (1983-1986) - A technically groundbreaking graphical computer, but its very high price and limited software market kept sales low. The later Macintosh made it largely redundant.
    Twentieth Anniversary Macintosh (1997) - A lavish, limited-edition Mac that was far too expensive for its performance and arrived as Apple was
    struggling financially. Its price was eventually cut sharply.
    eWorld (1994-1996) - Apple's online service, competing with CompuServe and AOL. It was polished but expensive, Mac-centric, and unable to build a
    large subscriber base.
    Cyberdog (1996-1997) - Apple's internet software suite for the classic Mac OS. It was discontinued before it could become a mainstream product. QuickTake cameras (1994-1997) - Among the earliest consumer digital
    cameras, but quickly outpaced by competitors and discontinued after Apple's camera business was sold.
    Apple USB Mouse / "hockey puck" mouse (1998-2000) - The round shape made it difficult for many people to orient and use comfortably. Apple replaced it with a more conventional design.
    Apple Pro Mouse (2000-2005) - Its clear shell and touch-sensitive button
    were distinctive, but the lack of a scroll wheel frustrated many users.
    Later versions added scrolling.
    iPod Hi-Fi (2006-2007) - A premium speaker dock for the iPod. Its high
    price and limited features made it difficult to compete with less expensive speaker systems.
    iPod shuffle, third generation (2009-2010) - It removed the device's
    physical controls and relied on inline headphone controls and spoken menus. Apple restored buttons in the next model.
    iPod nano, seventh generation (2012-2017) - A capable small music player,
    but it arrived as smartphones were absorbing the dedicated music-player market. The nano line was discontinued.
    iPod touch, final generation (2019-2022) - It remained useful as a low-cost iOS device, but its aging hardware and shrinking role in a phone-centered market led Apple to discontinue it.

    Services and software that didn't last

    Apple's social-networking efforts - Ping was the clearest example, but
    Apple repeatedly tried to add social features to music and media products without building a durable social platform.
    iTunes LP (2009-2018) - A digital-album format with liner notes, videos,
    and other extras. It never became a standard way to buy music and was eventually phased out.
    iTunes Extras for music albums - Bonus material attached to digital albums never became a major selling point for most customers.
    MobileMe Gallery and iDisk - Features of MobileMe that were discontinued as Apple shifted toward iCloud's simpler storage and photo-syncing model.
    Ping's successor social features in iTunes - Apple continued experimenting with artist pages, sharing, and recommendations, but none recreated the engagement of dedicated social platforms.
    Apple's "Ping" integration with Facebook and Twitter - The idea that users would share music activity from inside iTunes did not overcome the fact
    that people already used general-purpose social networks.
    iTunes Radio (2013-2016) - The ad-supported radio service was folded into Apple Music. It had a limited footprint and struggled to stand out against established streaming services.
    Beats Music (2014-2015 as a standalone service) - Apple bought Beats and
    its streaming service, but retired the standalone app and migrated the service into Apple Music.
    Apple Music Connect (2015-2018) - A social feature for artists to post directly to fans. It failed to become a compelling destination and was removed.
    Apple's original TV app strategy - For years, Apple TV hardware and
    software did not deliver the all-in-one television experience many
    expected. The product survived, but the broader ambition repeatedly fell short of expectations.
    Apple TV+'s early library strategy - The service launched with a small
    slate of original shows and no large back catalog. That was a weakness at launch, even though the service later expanded.
    iAd (2010-2016) - Apple's mobile advertising network failed to win enough advertisers and publishers to compete effectively. Apple shut it down.
    Apple Maps Connect / business-listing tools - Apple has repeatedly had to improve how businesses manage their information in Maps, reflecting the difficulty of maintaining accurate local listings at scale.

    Hardware and product-line misfires

    Power Mac G4 Cube (2000-2001) - Beautifully designed and technically interesting, but expensive, less expandable than a tower, and not powerful enough for its price. Apple suspended production after weak sales.
    PowerBook 5300 (1995) - A high-profile laptop family troubled by
    reliability issues, including battery and component problems, damaging its reputation.
    Power Mac G4 Cube's acrylic case - The case was striking but prone to
    visible cracking, adding to customer concerns about an already niche
    product.
    Macintosh Portable (1989-1991) - A large, heavy, expensive portable Mac.
    Its weight and price made it a poor fit for the "portable" promise.
    20th Anniversary Macintosh - Also worth mentioning separately from the broader anniversary line: its luxury design could not compensate for its
    poor value.
    Apple eMate 300 (1997-1998) - A Newton-based laptop aimed at education. It was discontinued when Apple ended the Newton platform.
    Apple QuickTake - Apple's early digital-camera line was a pioneering
    effort, but it could not compete with the pace of the camera market.
    Apple's licensed Mac-clone program (1995-1997) - It produced some well-regarded machines, but Apple concluded it was cannibalizing Mac sales and ended the program.
    Macintosh Performa line (1990s) - A confusing sprawl of overlapping models and inconsistent naming made it hard for buyers to understand Apple's
    lineup. Apple later simplified its product range.
    Apple's early consumer desktop experiments - Models such as the Performa
    and several low-end Macs suffered from confusing positioning and frequent revisions, rather than one single catastrophic product failure.
    Apple Watch Edition in solid gold (2015-2016) - The $10,000-plus luxury version was discontinued after one generation. The broader Apple Watch succeeded; the gold version did not become a lasting product category. AirPower (announced 2017, canceled 2019) - Apple announced a wireless charging mat that could charge multiple devices in flexible positions, then canceled it after failing to meet its standards.
    Apple Car / Project Titan (roughly 2014-2024) - Apple spent years exploring an electric and autonomous vehicle, but never announced a product and ultimately ended the project.
    Apple's rumored television set - A full Apple-branded TV was widely anticipated but never shipped. Apple instead pursued the Apple TV box and
    TV app.
    HomePod (first generation, 2018-2021) - The original speaker was praised
    for sound quality but criticized for its high price, limited smart-home ecosystem, and narrow service support. Apple discontinued it, then later revived the HomePod line with a new model.
    HomePod mini's original Siri limitations - The hardware found a broader audience, but Siri's capabilities and smart-home reliability lagged expectations. That's a product weakness, not a failure of the mini itself. Apple Vision Pro's initial market performance - The first headset was an expensive, niche product with limited everyday use cases. It is too early
    to call the platform a definitive failure, but the launch did not resemble
    a mass-market hit.

    Strategic bets that didn't work as intended

    Apple's dependence on the Macintosh in the 1990s - The Mac remained important, but Apple's shrinking market share, confusing product lineup,
    and financial troubles showed that the strategy was not sustainable in its then-current form.
    The Copland operating-system project (1994-1996) - Apple's attempt to build
    a modern Mac OS replacement collapsed under delays and technical
    complexity. Apple canceled it and eventually acquired NeXT, whose
    technology became the basis for Mac OS X.
    Taligent - A joint Apple-IBM-Motorola effort to build a next-generation operating system and software framework. It failed to deliver the promised platform and was wound down.
    Pink - An earlier Apple initiative for a next-generation operating system.
    It was spun into Taligent and never became the successor to the classic Mac OS.
    OpenDoc - A component-based software architecture promoted by Apple and partners. It failed to gain broad developer adoption and was discontinued. Cyberdog and OpenDoc together - Cyberdog was meant to showcase OpenDoc, but the platform's complexity and limited ecosystem prevented either from
    taking off.
    Apple's early PDA strategy - The Newton was innovative, but Apple did not turn it into a durable, dominant product line before the market shifted. Apple's first online-services strategy - eWorld and related services failed to compete with larger, more established networks.
    Apple's attempt to make iTunes the center of all digital media - iTunes was enormously influential, but its increasingly crowded desktop app became cumbersome and was eventually split into separate Mac apps.

    Important caveats

    Discontinued doesn't always mean failed. The iPod, for example, was a huge success whose role diminished as the iPhone took over.
    A product can fail commercially and still matter technically. The Newton, Lisa, and QuickTake helped establish ideas that became more successful
    later.
    Some entries are mixed cases. Apple Maps had a disastrous launch but recovered; HomePod's first generation was discontinued, but the product category returned; Vision Pro's long-term outcome is still unsettled.
    Apple has also had many quiet cancellations that never became public products, so the list is necessarily incomplete .

    Despite their failures, they still managed to become one of the most
    valuable corporations on Earth despite almost going bankrupt in the late
    90s. They aren't immune, but at least their failures are not as
    noticeable as the Microsoft ones. The failures are usually products
    clients were not obligated to use rather than problems within the system
    of hardware people indeed bought.
    --
    CrudeSausage
    MacBook Air M4 Sky Blue
    iPhone 13
    Friendly Apple zealot
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Paul@nospam@needed.invalid to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 15:37:56 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On Fri, 10/16/2026 12:33 PM, Maria Sophia wrote:
    Paul wrote:
    The number is not important, as the real number is 50,000.

    Not only the number, but the seriousness of each bug is what matters most.

    Paul has the correct response to the "why only 2" that the Apple religious zealot asked, where we must note the religious zealot actually *believes* there were only 2 bugs in all of Apple's releases compared to 1400 in Windows.

    I won't belabor how absurd that is, other than to say this thread was *opened* by an Apple religious zealot expressly to point out that poor Windows has 1400 bugs while Apple has... hmmm... they simply didn't say.

    What is notable, always, is the Apple user is desperate to claim some "advantage" over Windows, even as they have to fabricate that advantage.

    Although... I must note... I too am shocked at the 1400 figure, but I don't keep track of this stuff day to day. Is 1400 a normal number for Windows?

    Dunno.
    Does anyone?

    Why 1400 this time?
    Is that a typical amount for Windows?

    If not, what is the typical amount?
    (e.g., Apple's last bug count was over 200).


    You know as well as I do, that what an LLM-AI army produces, is critically affected by the prompt used to do it. That's one reason defects will be
    missed, by not including additional sentences to cover them off. You have
    to "know the answer" when writing a query, to get a good answer in return.

    The person who spent $120,000 worth of tokens, to translate some TypeScript
    to RUST, relates in his blog, what mistakes he made in the instructions
    to his framework. How some of the machines, when hitting blocking behavior
    from one of the "roles" in the framework, went around it and did things
    they weren't supposed to do. None of his files got erased, it wasn't
    a context failure. And some things happened, when he closed the
    lid on his laptop (which was running as the command center for the
    small army of machines). He was apparently traveling, while running
    this stuff, and not sitting at his desk. Even though this is a smart
    person who is well up the Wizard Ladder, the lesson is always the same,
    that "it would have worked better if my query was slightly different".

    And 1400 is not a typical number for Windows. Assuming we're dealing with
    the same metric as in the graph, that's like 20x any "normal" amount.

    https://www.rapid7.com/blog/post/em-patch-tuesday-april-2026/

    There's another graph here.

    https://arstechnica.com/security/2026/09/microsoft-patches-a-record-972-vulnerabilities-112-of-them-critical/

    Paul
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Maria Sophia@mariasophia@comprehension.com to alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy on Fri Oct 16 21:49:45 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    Paul wrote:
    If not, what is the typical amount?
    (e.g., Apple's last bug count was over 200).


    You know as well as I do, that what an LLM-AI army produces, is critically affected by the prompt used to do it. That's one reason defects will be missed, by not including additional sentences to cover them off. You have
    to "know the answer" when writing a query, to get a good answer in return.

    Yup. +1. Agreed. Understood. The output is directly related to the input.
    In addition, each LLM adds/removes/hallucinates its own particular flavor.

    In general, I employ at least 4 LLMs at a time when running a given query. Sometimes I need the output from one to be fed to the input of the others.

    The person who spent $120,000 worth of tokens, to translate some TypeScript to RUST, relates in his blog, what mistakes he made in the instructions
    to his framework. How some of the machines, when hitting blocking behavior from one of the "roles" in the framework, went around it and did things
    they weren't supposed to do. None of his files got erased, it wasn't
    a context failure. And some things happened, when he closed the
    lid on his laptop (which was running as the command center for the
    small army of machines). He was apparently traveling, while running
    this stuff, and not sitting at his desk. Even though this is a smart
    person who is well up the Wizard Ladder, the lesson is always the same,
    that "it would have worked better if my query was slightly different".

    I didn't know that, but yup. I use LLM all day, every day instead of
    search. What you get out is a direct consequence of what you put into it.

    Even when you constrain an LLM with 'session rules', it doesn't respect
    them. You have to hang on & ride the LLM like you ride a bucking bronco.

    And 1400 is not a typical number for Windows. Assuming we're dealing with
    the same metric as in the graph, that's like 20x any "normal" amount.
    https://www.rapid7.com/blog/post/em-patch-tuesday-april-2026/
    There's another graph here.
    https://arstechnica.com/security/2026/09/microsoft-patches-a-record-972-vulnerabilities-112-of-them-critical/

    As for the metric, an LLM told me "The Ars Technica link reports 972 vulnerabilities for September 2026", so the same data has two values.

    Rapid7, April 2026: 167 Patch Tuesday vulnerabilities, plus 80 browser vulnerabilities reported separately.

    Ars Technica, September 2026: 972 vulnerabilities; 997 if you also count Chromium fixes ported into Edge .

    So, um, er, surprise. The numbers don't line up. As you had expected.

    As for the Apple religious zealot thinking there were only 2 bugs in all
    Apple releases, it's amazing the belief systems that Apple owners have.

    They're never based on reality.
    And yet, they strongly hold to them.

    At least Windows owners are honest with themselves, as are you & I.
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Carlos E.R.@robin_listas@es.invalid to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Sat Oct 17 19:49:56 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 2026-10-15 23:39, Joel W. Crump wrote:
    On 10/15/2026 5:30 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-15 3:42 p.m., Carlos E.R. wrote:
    On 2026-10-14 17:50, CrudeSausage wrote:
    On 2026-10-13 9:09 p.m., Alan K. wrote:
    On 10/13/26 8:34 PM, CrudeSausage wrote:

    <https://shorturl.at/nFg3w>

    Today is Microsoft's October 2026 Patch Tuesday, with security
    updates
    addressing a record-breaking 1,411 flaws, including one actively
    exploited and two publicly disclosed zero-day vulnerabilities.

    Could a link to that article have saved the time and effort?   I'd >>>>> like to think so.

    It's right at the top. In fact, you quoted it.

    No, that's not the link.

    I never open shortlinks, they can be malware.

    That's not a bad approach.


    If I navigate to a bad site, Norton blocks me, I honestly think it's
    worth having over Microsoft Defender.  I consider a Win11 PC to be
    mostly carefree but with that solid antimalware package in place, it
    gives me a reassurance.

    I am on Linux :-P

    Then I will retort that shortlinks might not survive many years, while
    posts might. If the post contain long full links, the reader gets an
    idea of what might be at the other end before actually going there. The destination server may be gone, or has changed location. With the full
    link there is a chance of finding the current, modified link.
    --
    Cheers, Carlos.
    ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From John Bokma@contact@johnbokma.com to comp.sys.mac.advocacy,alt.comp.os.windows-11,comp.os.linux.advocacy on Sat Oct 17 19:55:50 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

    On 16/10/2026 03:42, Maria Sophia wrote:

    [..]
    For example:
    *Protecting against malware in macOS*
    <https://support.apple.com/guide/security/protecting-against-malware-sec469d47bd8/web>

    Those don't seem to protect against bugs.
    a. Gatekeeper and notarization don't detect bugs
    b. Xprotect only detects known malware, not bugs
    c. System Integrity Protection protects from changes in system files

    The latter also protects against bugs where one can accidentally
    (because of a bug) overwrite system files. Such bugs do exists and have
    been exploited.

    Also, writing with less foaming at the mouth would be welcome; you come
    over as a zealot.
    --
    Static tumblelog generator: https://github.com/john-bokma/tumblelog/
    Available as Python or Perl. Example tumblelog: https://plurrrr.com/
    --- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2